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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:34 am 
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Curiosity Inc. wrote:
How the relationship started isn't a mystery to me. It's what kept the relationship going that puzzles me.



Great topic.

First, for Jon, the relationship started, continued, and ended because it did. He remembered it as surely as you remember yesterday as a certainty.

For Laurie... it's a matter of being Mary. You're a horny teenager. God himself wants a go. Who's gonna say, "no?"


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 6:46 am 
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Quote:
It's what kept the relationship going that puzzles me.

Agent Forbes summed it up quite nicely for me with "meal ticket". If the US's top weapon is gonna get laid, then whoever's doin' the layin' is gonna get paid, girl... no doubt courtesy of a big old expense account from her Uncle Sam. All told, Laurie's never done an average, normal honest day's work for an honest day's pay in her life.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 10:16 am 
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Vynson wrote:
For Laurie... it's a matter of being Mary. You're a horny teenager. God himself wants a go. Who's gonna say, "no?"
Curiosity Inc. wrote:
How the relationship started isn't a mystery to me. It's what kept the relationship going that puzzles me.


Two Words: Jon's Shlongs!

What girl wouldn't like that a man can change and make it bigger? She gets laid by Jon and paid by the goverment to do that!

She's a goverment's whore to a superweapon. Do really think she's in love? has any future with Dr. Manhattan? a future with kids?

No! She's just in for the ride! Her theme song should be....

"She take my money when I'm in need
Yea she's a trifflin friend indeed
Oh she's a gold digga way over town
That dig's on me"

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 4:33 pm 
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"I aint sayin' she's a gold diggah!
But she aint messin' with no broke superheroes...."

Sorry, there was no other way for me to finish that sentence.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 11:15 pm 
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t3cii wrote:
"I aint sayin' she's a gold diggah!
But she aint messin' with no broke superheroes...."

Sorry, there was no other way for me to finish that sentence.

I dunno. I can't see Laurie consciously whoring herself out for whatever purpose.

Remember, when she picked up the restaurant tab at the end of Chapter I, she didn't seem too happy about being a "kept woman." A few pages later, in Chapter II, Laurie denies that Jon is an H-bomb, though it's staring her straight in the face that "the only difference is that the H-bomb didn't need to get laid every once in a while," (pardon if the quotations are slightly off).

No, there's something else going on there.

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 Post subject: LAURIE IS NOT A SLUT!
PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 12:03 am 
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Curiosity Inc. wrote:
I dunno. I can't see Laurie consciously whoring herself out for whatever purpose.


I agree. Calling Laurie a whore is a cheap shot. Jon is the only relationship she's ever had. Like Jon, she's never really had to make any decisions either. Her mother chose her career. Like many women of her generation, she went straight from the family home to the conjugal bed.

And what example did she have to follow? Sally married her manager when adventuring got stale...

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:28 am 
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The fact that Laurie doesn't have a real job since the ban of vigilantes (i don't even think she gets paid during either) makes me think she goes whoring to Jon for security (both monetory and protection).

What started her relationship was that she was a teenager with raging hormones then, but growing older, she has no one to support her, so sticking it with Jon (figuratively and literaly ;) ) made her life easy. At her age of 33, she realise her life is incomplete.

She's the only vigilante without a mask, so asking for a job would be embarassing, or dangerous to her as she'll be a mark person.

So yeah, whoring herself to Jon would be a stop gap before she meets with Dan, and what a coincidence, Dan's rich!

*quietly humming 'She takes my money.....'* :D

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 3:10 am 
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You'll pardon me if I give Laurie more credit than to assume that she's a simple opportunist.

The idea that Laurie would sleep with Jon (or Dan) purely for money just doesn't sit well with me. Granted, she's never held an honest job in her life, but I think that's mostly because she couldn't take a stable job if she tried. She doesn't know anything else. Her mom pushed her into a very specific career, which left Laurie with no place to go when that career was outlawed.

The protection idea, however, sounds okay.

Physically, of course, she can handle herself. But emotionally, she doesn't really have anyone to fall back on. It must've seemed like the best idea to depend on Jon. Who better to rely on for emotional support than the most powerful man alive?

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 4:37 am 
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Curiosity Inc. wrote:
You'll pardon me if I give Laurie more credit than to assume that she's a simple opportunist.


Hey Curi, no probs. i respect your view. i just find it more interesting to flaw Laurie's character in another way. :D

That is what makes watchmen so great. It's not enough that the character is flawed, but how they are flawed is also a contest.

The readers perception of what the characters are is reflective to our individual upbringing. hehe, probably i'm surrounded by to many gold diggers for me to imply Laurie as that. ;)

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:51 am 
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Junky_dude wrote:
i just find it more interesting to flaw Laurie's character in another way.


One could argue it says a lot about how you view women.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:50 am 
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dandreiberg wrote:
Junky_dude wrote:
i just find it more interesting to flaw Laurie's character in another way.


One could argue it says a lot about how you view women.


haha, no i don't view all women in that manner. :D Don't take me wrong. Her character itself is intriguing.

That's why i started this thread, to understand the relationship of Laurie and Dr. Manhattan. Based on others' replies makes me understand more about her. ;)

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 12:36 pm 
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Junky_dude wrote:
haha, no i don't view all women in that manner.


Your comment seemed to imply otherwise. It wasn't unusual for women of her generation to take on the "job" of keeping house spotless and hubby happy. Does that mean they were all whores (a term I find objectionable in this context) too??

Curiosity Inc. wrote:
The idea that Laurie would sleep with Jon (or Dan) purely for money just doesn't sit well with me.


I think Laurie became trapped. Once she moved in with Jon (something which was probably condoned by both the Pentagon and Sally) she pursued "adventuring" (the only job she knew) until the passing of the Keene Act. After that, her job prospects were pretty limited, due to her skill set.

I suppose she could have taken training or gone to university or something, but I suspect the big brass would dissuade her from doing anything that would focus her attentions away from Big Blue. Her choices were become a government sanctioned concubine, or ...nothing. I also doubt the big boys in the establishment would have just let her walk away unless Jon was patently unhappy with her.

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 Post subject: "you're a looker"
PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:10 pm 
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Laurie's character is the least defined in the text. But it demands the most attention to understand.

She is not a 2 dimensional character. Of all the characters in the story, she demands the most attention because she is the thematic link between all characters.


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 Post subject: Re: "you're a looker"
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:01 am 
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Vynson wrote:
Laurie's character is the least defined in the text. But it demands the most attention to understand.

She is not a 2 dimensional character. Of all the characters in the story, she demands the most attention because she is the thematic link between all characters.


Is she the "quark" with "charm" and "strange"ness?

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:04 am 
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dandreiberg wrote:
Curiosity Inc. wrote:
I dunno. I can't see Laurie consciously whoring herself out for whatever purpose.


I agree. Calling Laurie a whore is a cheap shot. Jon is the only relationship she's ever had. Like Jon, she's never really had to make any decisions either. Her mother chose her career. Like many women of her generation, she went straight from the family home to the conjugal bed.

And what example did she have to follow? Sally married her manager when adventuring got stale...


That's a very good point actually, and as Vynson said. She's the least defined character in the text, but requires more attention to fully compensate for that 2-D like world.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 7:32 am 
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laurie, the least defined character in the book? i´m surprised. how can you say that?
for once, she´s the one of whose family and upbringing we know that most, see the most. that allows to make many assumptions.
we know about her childhood. we know about the complicated relationship with her mother (and her husband). we know how she felt pushed to follow her mother´s footsteps. we get many, many clues how she feels and felt about jon. most importantly: she makes many important choices, after an upbringing that actually discouraged it!
first choice: leave jon.
second choice: get together with dan.
third choice, the most interesting: after she´s finally free to live her own live, she decides that, in fact masked adventuring is the life she wants to live!
gosh, i could go on. sure that there isn´t a bit of "guy perspective" clouding the picture? ;)

as to why she fell in love with jon: why not? as it´s been stated: he´s exotic, he´s beautiful, he´s wise (or that´s what she thought), he´s powerful ... she only leaves him when he´s getting so detached from common humanity that she can´t take it any longer.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:18 am 
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I feel that Laurie was drawn by the "essecense" of Dr. Manhattan, more than the actual man.

You see, Laurie was 16, clearly not thinking with her brain, but instead hormones, and seeing this powerful man that all the world is watching, the thought of his power makes him attractive, not his looks or "personality" :roll: . but because He had unlimited power and he could make her feel like no other guy could.

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 Post subject: Question About Laurie?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:19 am 
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Nellodee wrote:
sure that there isn´t a bit of "guy perspective" clouding the picture?


I would think that there is an argument that this is an inevitability. Unless, of course, a woman comes in to add her opinion. Nice post.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:22 am 
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Quote:
sure that there isn´t a bit of "guy perspective" clouding the picture?



I have to agree, Guys do lok at this differently than a girl might, because most guys on here probably wouldn't consider dating a real world Manhattan for the simple fact we don't swing that way. I don't know though.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 11:29 am 
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Fine, then I will articulate an argument! (is a womanz)
I don't go for the "Laurie is a whore" perspective, but rather the "what else is she supposed to do?" argument.
It's not like she got into the relationship with Doc because she was looking for a cushy govt job where she whored herself out. She fell in love with him because...she fell in love. Whatever her personal reasons were. I think the power explanation makes a lot of sense, a lot of women (more so back then than now) want a guy who is powerful, commanding, sure of himself etc. etc. She saw those things in Doc, whether or not they were there. Especially with her lack of a strong paternal figure, she would be looking for those characteristics somewhere else.
Then, she was together with Doc, living comfortably for a few years. The Keene act was passed, she didn't have anything else to do, but she was "happy" taking care of Doc and managing the house and such. She actually probably really wanted to like being a housewife, because it was the exact opposite of what her mom was. She probably purposely allowed herself to be that, just to try to be normal.
Then, as she slowly came to the realization that the Doc was emotionally detached and just totally emotionally unavailable, it was much later into her life. I don't want to say she was "comfortable", because that sounds like she just didn't want to give up her govt check. But really she didn't have anything else to do. And it wasn't like he was abusing her, and who knows "maybe he would change". Maybe she figured he would go back to the way he was when they were first together, or the way she thought he was when they were first together.
tl;dr: she's not a whore.


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