WatchmenComicMovie.com Forum

This is something that has been on my mind for a while now. A few weeks ago I saw a thread on the Scott Pilgrim boards on IMDB where somebody expressed concern that the only minorities depicted in the film were Asian people. It suprised me that nobody brought up that one of the main characters, Wallace, was a homosexual. I also saw a recent episode of south park where Cartman was at a public pool making a big deal about minorities, but there was no mention of Kyle being Jewish.
I am now coming to understand that in the USA that the term minority does not actually mean a social minority, but rather anybody who is not white.
My mother, an Australian, said that when she lived in USA she was not classed as a minority either.
Only in America could such an ignorant and racist way of thinking become a social norm.
Can anybody here help me understand this, or present their own opinion on this.

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Say, Doc, did I ever tell you I'm the only metal that's liquid at room temperature?

You're right on the money, dude. Technically, gays, foreigners, etc. ARE minorities, but the majority of the population sees minority as "non-white." You and me have argued about the immigration issue, but you can see why I see so much racism in the immigration issue. The racism in America is harsh, not because it's full on neo-nazi rallies, but because it's accepted into the social norm and nobody even bats and eyelash.

To me a minority can be racial, social, etc. Gays are minorities, "white" immigrants are minorities, etc.

It doesn't seem like we can help you with anything, you seem to understand it perfectly well

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Mexicano Al Grito De Guerra

not entirely. mostly, but religion and ethical background apply for minority as well. take brooklyn and queens for example. brooklyn is filled to shit with russians and italians. queens is a melting pot, where us white folk are the minority. of course, minority status in queens depends on your location. say my school for example. if i walk just down the street, i become the minority. why? everyone down the street is middle eastern, black, and either jewish or muslim.

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Another example of this thing came just a few minutes ago, and it seems like the person wasn't at all intentionally racist, and to a lot of people may be seen as a defender of "minorities".
The example:
Little Big Planet is offering skins of Marvel characters. The characters on offer are "Captain America, Daredevil, Doctor Octopus, Elektra, Ghost Rider, Green Goblin, Hulk, Invisible Woman, Iron Man, The Human Torch, Magneto, Mystique, The Punisher, Roque, Spider-Man, Storm, The Thing, Thor, Venom, Wolverine". Somebody on Superhero Hype made the comment "Is Storm the only minority character in the bunch?? -wow-".
Of course, Mystique is gay, Magneto is Jewish and Elektra is greek. It is extremely shocking that this kind of singling out of people with coloured skin is thought to be completely normal, and in this case, the opposite to racism, in the year 2010.

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Say, Doc, did I ever tell you I'm the only metal that's liquid at room temperature?

I agree.

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Mexicano Al Grito De Guerra

The way I see it, socially accepted bigotry hasn't gone away. It's just gotten more subtle. Though that's still a huge improvement over a few decades ago.

The key to solving this is to rally around what the various cultures have in common (America) and to make their peace with their differences. It's a tall order, but give it a few generations. It'll happen.

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This is truly a madhouse. And I'm the lunatic running it. I've spent three years wondering if I should be proud or ashamed.

another grand reason i don't waste time on SHH

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I was originally mildly offended by this post and had every intention of mounting some sort of defense or, at the very least, a bit of a deflection (it's not like the U.S. has cornered the market on racism, after all). However, after giving it a quick bit of thought, I have to admit that using the word "minority" as a codeword for race (which it most definitely is, you're 100% correct about that) is so subtly and devilishly racist that it had never even occurred to me that it was being used in that way.

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it is quite funny that asians are consiodered a minority when there are more asians than whites in the world.

but generally the term "minority" is only used to mean "racial minority within a community" so only taking race into account, and being dealt with within a community, not internationally.
in a city in china, white people would be among the minorities, as they would be in almost every city in the world apart from in North America, Europe, Russia and Australasia. so i don't think the word is inherently racist, although it could be used as such. like if someone said "minorities have no right to be here" that would be racist but if someone said "people within minority groups deserve to be represented" obviously that isn't racist.

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We're all actors, Laurie. I'm just an actor who read the script.

It's my understanding that America is the only country where Minority exclusively means Skin Colour rather than social minority.

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Say, Doc, did I ever tell you I'm the only metal that's liquid at room temperature?

nope, that way of using it is used in the UK too

when not using it to just mean non-whites, where do you draw the line though, nearly everyone is a minority on one way or another, be they gay, non-christian, hell, even racists are a minority.

in that case, what is the point in having the word at all? the point is, people would just come up with another word to mean non-whites and we'd be back where we started

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We're all actors, Laurie. I'm just an actor who read the script.

My football buddies and I went to China and we were all like, "Dude! Look at all these minoritites!"

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"The world is a fine place and worth fighting for." I agree with the second part.

"There's a cello in your house now."

Like Curi said, it's a VERY subtle way to keep the lines that separate the citizens, specially when it comes to non-white.

I feel, like Smutty and Diego, that this is a problem.

But I don't think, that it can go away easily, people in the US have an incredible problem with ethnicity, they give it a lot of importance even when it's completely irrelevant in several cases.

As an example, black people NEED to forget about the color of their skin, they only make it worse when they actively differentiate themselves as african-americans, when they are "proud" of their ethnicity, when they support affirmative action, or even when Al Sharpton goes on yet another rant.

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I'm just going to pretend you didn't say that.

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Perhaps I should rephrase that, I should use the "Preview" button more often

It's not that a black person shouldn't feel pride about their ancestors or about their history, but some dude reminding me again, again AND AGAIN, that his great-great-grandfather was a slave is doing nothing for anyone.

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AYB, thank you for quoting Malcolm X. He was amazing. Also, I love how when you quote someone outside of the forum, it seems like they were quoted within the forum.
For a second I was like "Malcolm X is on the forum? And here I am being given the task of 'breaking niggers' in the stupid destiny thread..."

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Mexicano Al Grito De Guerra

I think the problem involves how to define a "minority." In the US, racism is (as has been noted) a severe institutional issue, so we usually assume that a person's race is the biggest obstacle in terms of jobs, social acceptance, movie roles, etc. But, of course, religious discrimination (especially against Muslims and, in government, atheists) and sexuality discrimination continue to run rampant in society. There are embedded reasons for Americans believing that "minorities" do not include religious or sexual minorities:

1. The huge, widespread misconception that "America was founded as a Christian nation," and thus it's your fault for living on US soil and not being a Christian. "Freedom of religion" is interpreted as "a law that allows Muslims to exist without being shot in the streets" instead of its intended purpose, "all religions and ideologies existing equally." For many Americans, the idea that someone might not be a Christian is a shocking and disturbing concept--so it slips their mind when thinking about what a minority is.

2. The continued pseudoscientific propaganda campaign that "being gay is a choice," and thus it's (again) your fault for not being straight. You deserve discrimination. Being a "minority by choice" doesn't mesh well with most people, even though that choice doesn't actually exist.

In other words: due to anti-religious discrimination laws that have existed since the US was founded, most people don't seem to consider non-Christians to be a minority in the US, and the belief that gay people are only a minority by choice prevents them from receiving the same societal benefits as racial minorities.

Now, the issue is compounded when we question whether other groups can be considered minorities for the purpose of receiving benefits or societal aid. Let's say that I'm a white Christian from Italy. Unless my employer has some irrational hatred of Italians or I don't speak English, I'm not really at any disadvantage anywhere in the US institutional system, despite being a "minority." The entire point of recognizing minority groups is to give aid to individuals who may be put at a disadvantage in the US institutional system (work, school, etc) because of something unchangable about yourself that may be discriminated against by the people in charge. It's an attempt to offset institutional discrimination. And because racial minorities are the most vulnerable to institutional discrimination in the US, they receive the most attention and aid.

In a worst case scenario, you could hide your religion, sexuality, and nationality--but you can't hide your race. It's the easiest target, and the one most commonly attacked in the US. This is why it receives the most attention.

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I don't mind being the smartest man in the world. I just wish it wasn't this one.

^ Dude, where have you been ?

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