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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:04 am 
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(No, you're not the only girl. Just responding to your signature.)

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 5:10 am 
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I hope I wasn't coming across as a pompous ass, but for me it takes very little to treat everyone with a modicum of civility, even if you don't agree with them. There is never an excuse for being blatantly insulting or rude.

One of things I really like about this forum is the fact that for the vast majority of posts and members, everyone does post in a reasoned and reasonable fashion. For that I am very grateful. That's why I'd hate to see things change.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:28 am 
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Aaron T. wrote:
Mere Being wrote:
namuras wrote:
When you say "six pack" are you talking about defined abdominals?
In Spain we call them "chocolate bar" :D


in brazil we call it 'crocodile belly' or...u know those huh home ponds (?) where women do some laundry? you know those sinks with rough border where u can rub a dirty clothe...


"Washboard abs"... We call it that in the U.S. too.



ahhaha? no joke?

oh humanity...

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 8:19 am 
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BunnyCritters wrote:
Darkweaver wrote:
There is no excuse for unpleasant behaviour. Ad hominen insults, or name-calling are the refuge of those who cannot support their arguments with rationality or logic.

You may not agree with someone, fair enough, this site amongst thousands of other thrives on differing view points and the comments and debates that are spawned as a result of that, but one always has to bear in mind that you are responisbile for your behaviour, and act accordingly.

I previously called out Vynson on his comments and tone, I will not accept people adopting that with me. The argument, he knows he's being a dick and apologises sometimes for it, is not an acceptable excuse.

If you are about to post something, before you hit submit, reread it. Then ask yourself the question, "If someone posted this as a response to something I had written, would I get irritated, or annoyed or upset". If the answer is yes, then modify the post.

I have had several involved debates with people on the site, but with one notable exception (the Vynson incident previously mentioned) I like to think I've been civil and polite with everyone. Even though I am not a moderator, nor have any editorial power here, as a member of the community, I feel compelled to post to ask people to not directly attack others, even if you do not agree with them.

Treat them with the respect you would have others treat you.


I greatly appreciate this post, you said what I think people needed to hear. :D

it's actually one of the main reasons why I rarely post in the Watchmen forum, people are very inclined to insult people based on irrelevant things (spelling, grammar, whatever) when they don't agree with their opinion. While I enjoyed reading Vynson's posts, as he had interesting takes on the topics and was very well spoken, his attitude when explaining things to others was kind of "greater than thou." Very off putting.

Also, while I appreciated what Kingmob brings to the table, his comments are very negative in nature 90% of the time.

I think people need to develop their senses of humor and not get so easily offended. This is a forum, not a lecture hall.

Don't get so worked up! ;)

a good diplomacy is always the best way to go. ;)

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 8:53 am 
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Junky_dude wrote:
BunnyCritters wrote:
Darkweaver wrote:
There is no excuse for unpleasant behaviour. Ad hominen insults, or name-calling are the refuge of those who cannot support their arguments with rationality or logic.

You may not agree with someone, fair enough, this site amongst thousands of other thrives on differing view points and the comments and debates that are spawned as a result of that, but one always has to bear in mind that you are responisbile for your behaviour, and act accordingly.

I previously called out Vynson on his comments and tone, I will not accept people adopting that with me. The argument, he knows he's being a dick and apologises sometimes for it, is not an acceptable excuse.

If you are about to post something, before you hit submit, reread it. Then ask yourself the question, "If someone posted this as a response to something I had written, would I get irritated, or annoyed or upset". If the answer is yes, then modify the post.

I have had several involved debates with people on the site, but with one notable exception (the Vynson incident previously mentioned) I like to think I've been civil and polite with everyone. Even though I am not a moderator, nor have any editorial power here, as a member of the community, I feel compelled to post to ask people to not directly attack others, even if you do not agree with them.

Treat them with the respect you would have others treat you.


I greatly appreciate this post, you said what I think people needed to hear. :D

it's actually one of the main reasons why I rarely post in the Watchmen forum, people are very inclined to insult people based on irrelevant things (spelling, grammar, whatever) when they don't agree with their opinion. While I enjoyed reading Vynson's posts, as he had interesting takes on the topics and was very well spoken, his attitude when explaining things to others was kind of "greater than thou." Very off putting.

Also, while I appreciated what Kingmob brings to the table, his comments are very negative in nature 90% of the time.

I think people need to develop their senses of humor and not get so easily offended. This is a forum, not a lecture hall.

Don't get so worked up! ;)

a good diplomacy is always the best way to go. ;)


thar or the foe list

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 7:31 pm 
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when someone gets really mad at another, 'he went doc manhattan' ('the smartest man of the world is the smartest termite!')


I've actually said "Way to go Dr. Manhattan!" when people talking about time using the worng tebnse (yes, I am that big of a nerd where I actualyy listen to peoples tenses)

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:07 am 
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Darkweaver wrote:
There is no excuse for unpleasant behaviour. Ad hominen insults, or name-calling are the refuge of those who cannot support their arguments with rationality or logic.

I previously called out Vynson on his comments and tone, I will not accept people adopting that with me. The argument, he knows he's being a dick and apologises sometimes for it, is not an acceptable excuse.


No, I called you on the fact that you made a philosophical argument that murdering millions of (mostly) minorities is justifiable when trying to bring about your own idea of utopia.

"Unpleasant behavior?" By whose standards? Yours? Curiosity's? Frankly, I find your assertion that an anti-semitic mass murderer is "heroic" to be highly unpleasant.

Don't primp and posture, Darkweaver, because you are full of shit. Oh, I know, you prefer phony civility to the truth. Well tough. I prefer the truth.

I left this board because, instead of doing his job, Curiosity ignored your foul spoutings and only reared his authority when someone dared to raise his head and call bullshit on you and your wretched assertions.

Understand, I'll defend to the death your right to spout such crap... but I will also defend to that point the right of sane men to stand against it... to rail against it... to cry and banter and whine and rage and curse against it. And when Deputy Dawg comes around and acts like such a stand is a crime... then there's a site with a problem.

Oh, I know... it's just a graphic novel. Don't get so worked up. Ideas aren't important. Novels aren't important. And certainly graphic novels aren't important. Oh how many people wish someone had gotten worked up in the thirties, eh? When such ideas were merely novels? No. Far more important to meet Darkweaver's demands of civility while he casts ad hominems about. Yes, any reader of our posts will see that it was you initiating them, oh weaver of pitch.

Some of us have studied this book for decades now. If those who have read it once really want to engage in spirited debate, I think a few more readings are in order. Snotty? Fine. But I don't walk into an advanced Shakespeare class after reading Hamlet once and challenge the professor to a duel. Bunny Critters, I find it odd that your objections to me were only voiced once I abandoned the site. Male or female, I frankly would prefer the courage of your convictions to your behind the back comments.

I'm happy to stay away if this forum aspires to it's past mediocracies, but I don't harbor lies easily, and Darkweaver, you are a liar as anyone can learn for themselves if they care to read our past posts.

DD, the rest of the site is pretty damned impressive. I've enjoyed it.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:17 am 
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No, I called you on the fact that you made a philosophical argument that murdering millions of (mostly) minorities is justifiable when trying to bring about your own idea of utopia.


No Vynson, that is what the debate was about, I was refering to your arrogant and patronising attitude and ad hominem insults.

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"Unpleasant behavior?" By whose standards? Yours? Curiosity's? Frankly, I find your assertion that an anti-semitic mass murderer is "heroic" to be highly unpleasant.


Veidt isn't anti-semitic, and I have no admiration for any other mas murderers, fictional or otehrwise. Who are you refering to? In any case, debating a point reaonably and rationally, without condescending or patronising others is part of being a grown up. If you are unable to debate in a rational and reasonable fashion, then don't bother debating.

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Don't primp and posture, Darkweaver, because you are full of shit. Oh, I know, you prefer phony civility to the truth. Well tough. I prefer the truth.


Frankly this is precisely the type of thing I am talking about. Regardless of how you feel about me, and frankly my dear Vynson I don't care. That is no excuse for acting like a jerk. You assume that expressing an opinion means you have the right to be obnoxious and rude. It doesn't.

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I left this board because, instead of doing his job, Curiosity ignored your foul spoutings and only reared his authority when someone dared to raise his head and call bullshit on you and your wretched assertions.


Grow up. You left because you started being insulting, got called on it, and threw you toys out of the pram. We were debating the actions of a fictional character in a comic. If you can't seperate reality from fiction then frankly you need more help than I am capable of giving you. Can I suggest therapy?

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Understand, I'll defend to the death your right to spout such crap... but I will also defend to that point the right of sane men to stand against it... to rail against it... to cry and banter and whine and rage and curse against it. And when Deputy Dawg comes around and acts like such a stand is a crime... then there's a site with a problem


Can you not seperate fiction from reality? We are debating the morality of a fictional character. Your comments are insulting, stupid and frankly make you seem like a child who can't get their own way so they throw their toys out of the pram.

Quote:
Oh, I know... it's just a graphic novel. Don't get so worked up. Ideas aren't important. Novels aren't important. And certainly graphic novels aren't important. Oh how many people wish someone had gotten worked up in the thirties, eh? When such ideas were merely novels? No. Far more important to meet Darkweaver's demands of civility while he casts ad hominems about. Yes, any reader of our posts will see that it was you initiating them, oh weaver of pitch.


I see reality has finally begun to seep into your head. Frankly you are the one here with the track record of patronising, insulting and condescending behaviour. If people do not agree with you, you are happy to be rude and unpleasant. Well fuck you frankly. I called you on it, and you left in a sulk. Frankly you can go back to the same place you sulked off to, because I am done listening to your pathetic whining about how badly you got treated.

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Some of us have studied this book for decades now. If those who have read it once really want to engage in spirited debate, I think a few more readings are in order. Snotty? Fine. But I don't walk into an advanced Shakespeare class after reading Hamlet once and challenge the professor to a duel. Bunny Critters, I find it odd that your objections to me were only voiced once I abandoned the site. Male or female, I frankly would prefer the courage of your convictions to your behind the back comments.


You seem quite the one for revisionist history. I called you on your behaviour before you left. Frankly you can stay gone for all I care. And don't try to patronise me, I've read the book for at least as long as you have, and just because my ideas are different to yours doesn't make me wrong. Don't flatter yourself with the Professor analogy either.

Quote:
I'm happy to stay away if this forum aspires to it's past mediocracies, but I don't harbor lies easily, and Darkweaver, you are a liar as anyone can learn for themselves if they care to read our past posts.

DD, the rest of the site is pretty damned impressive. I've enjoyed it.


The arrogance. Oh well, I for one can only hope you decide to stay away this time, instead of trying to come back and revise history to suit your pathetic ego. Frankly I am not interested in any kind of discussion with you any more. Welcome to my ignore list.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:44 am 
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And yes before it gets pointed out, I was being insulting and rude. I have had enough of arrogant, obnoxious aresholes who think they can act anyway they want.

I apologise to the rest of the posters for my outburst, but felt it was necessary to respond to a childish, arrogant, rude cretin, who deserves to be put in his place.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:33 am 
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OK. I'm surprised this spouted up again since it died down a long time ago. I'm not going to declare a winner or a loser here because I honestly don't see any. Our two main combatants in this rage have both admitted to being rude and insulting. I don't care who started it and who was right, because, honestly, I don't have the time or energy to go back and read all of those angry posts and declare a victor.

I've said my piece on what I think is appropriate behavior. I think both of these guys just need to relax and move on. If they can't, so be it. They can either start ignoring the posts of the members that piss them off, place them on their foes list or just leave the forum altogether.

I don't want to see anybody leave. Both of these guys are obviously intelligent and have a lot of great input on the forum. Oddly enough, it was Vynson who convinced me to run my forum with a little more anarchy and I still agree with him on that point. I refuse to ban anyone on this matter or do anything else "official" since neither of them ever went to far over the line to warrant that. It's obvious they do have the ability to restrain themselves.

Assuming Vynson wants to be active on this forum again, let's just reboot. Forget this "clash of the titans" for the sake of the rest of the forum and move on. Yes, a do-over. This way nobody has to back down, admit their wrong or even apologize. Can we live with that? If not, via con dios.

I think that's a reasonable solution. If not, feel free to reply to this thread and give me a better solution.

Thanks.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:42 am 
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I've placed Vynson on my ignore list. End of problem. I refuse to listen to him, or to reply to anything further he has to say.

I am more than happy to move on. I was just not going to let his post stand without reply.

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 Post subject: "Silly Stuff"
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:49 am 
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I'd post that in the stupid thread but...well, things are heavier there right now and I prefer that Darkweaver and Vynson settle their diferences before. after that, if you mods would like to change it there, feel free.

well:

when i say silly stuff i refer to stupid and needless details that, nevetheless, i'd like to see in the movie.

for instance: the night owl metalic armour, behind Sally, when she's putting her shoes on, when she and dan begin to suit up.

the Silk Spectre I poster...signed by Varga

the newspaper blown by the wind over Owlship with the frontpage news "Cops say: let them do it!"

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 Post subject: Re: "Silly Stuff"
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:04 am 
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I think it is essential. Not silly at all.
By the way, that's one of the thing I enjoy the most while reading it, all the silly things with caotic precision. Everything has a relation, from water drops to a big smile on Mars.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:26 am 
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DoomsdayClock wrote:
I think that's a reasonable solution. If not, feel free to reply to this thread and give me a better solution.

Thanks.


I don't think there's any need to "declare a victor" or "find a solution." The posts are all there for anyone who cares enough to actually have an opinion on the subject. I stopped participating in this forum for two reasons. I think if you are going to have a moderator, there needs to be some consistency. Darkweaver started the namecalling because he didn't like my tone. Fine. I'm a grown up. No problem. But when I started to throw a little of that back his way, Curiosity decided it was time to put his foot down. Coupled with the fact that I'm just too busy to have the same discussions over and over, I opted to stop posting. Which was a great solution to the problem, I thought.

I enjoyed the rest of the site and perused the forum for anything new. Enjoyed reading some of the posts and some of the discussions on the sets and liked a lot of the observations people made in the video.

But then I read Darkweaver's post claiming some advanced civil attitude and how he called me out when I started throwing ad hominems at him and that's just a lie plain and simple as anyone who can read can readily see. So I posted my response.

I was gone. There was no need for him to make such a statement at this point. No need for anyone to choose up sides or initiate debate or even give a crap. I just don't like someone posturing with a lie about me and felt the need to say so.

As to whether I'll be active here again... not to the same degree. I'm extremely busy these days. If there is a discussion of some new insight, I'd love to participate and hope I'm welcome to do so. But I don't really want to have the same discussions I had ten years ago.

I enjoy perusing the site, though I do so less often. I appreciate the work you've put into it, DD.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:28 am 
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DoomsdayClock wrote:
If not, via con dios.

If that was spanish, it's "id con dios" for plural or "ve con dios" for singular :) I think it's a common mistake.

Btw... first Kingmob vs Mere Being , now Vynson vs Darkweaver... may we change this thread's topic to "Fight Club"? :D

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 Post subject: Re: "Silly Stuff"
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:38 am 
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of course they're essential...but i meant 'silly' when you focus your eyes only on the carachters and their dialogues or action. they're not truly all-important, but they sure add a puzzle piece that makes the whole conjunction...however, 'graphically' they could be considered effectless to 'newbie eyes'.

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Last edited by Mere Being on Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:48 am 
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Vynson wrote:
I stopped participating in this forum for two reasons. I think if you are going to have a moderator, there needs to be some consistency. Darkweaver started the namecalling because he didn't like my tone. Fine. I'm a grown up. No problem. But when I started to throw a little of that back his way, Curiosity decided it was time to put his foot down. Coupled with the fact that I'm just too busy to have the same discussions over and over, I opted to stop posting. Which was a great solution to the problem, I thought.

I never really understood why Curiosity's "OK. Settle down" comment got you so angry. He does this every so often when he sees members going at it and wants them both to take a deep breath. I don't think his comments were aimed at you specifically, but we'll need to ask him.

Vynson wrote:
But then I read Darkweaver's post claiming some advanced civil attitude and how he called me out when I started throwing ad hominems at him and that's just a lie plain and simple as anyone who can read can readily see. So I posted my response.

I was gone. There was no need for him to make such a statement at this point.

I'm not sure why he brought this argument up again either. I would have let sleeping dogs lie. I can understand why you felt it necessary to respond.

Vynson wrote:
I enjoy perusing the site, though I do so less often. I appreciate the work you've put into it, DD.

Thanks!

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:55 am 
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It's too bad Vynson's return has brought up so much animosity. I was interested in reading what his thoughts on the costumes were, and his opinion on the recently released photos of the action figures. Knowing his stance on the idea of Watchmen based toys, I think that would have been a fun read. ;)

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:46 am 
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DoomsdayClock wrote:
I never really understood why Curiosity's "OK. Settle down" comment got you so angry. He does this every so often when he sees members going at it and wants them both to take a deep breath. I don't think his comments were aimed at you specifically, but we'll need to ask him.
It wasn't.

My post at the time quoted both Vynson and Darkweaver. It was directed at both of them.

At the same time, I deeply respect both Vynson and Darkweaver and I hope that all of us can move past this.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:57 am 
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i say, let them jerk each other off silently in the dark, and enjoy the uncomfortable silence afterward.


they can sit and look at eachother in awkwardness like having dinner with an EX.

its the only way to move on and get over eachother really.....

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